Alpine V8 project start

Some of These May Be Obvious

At the risk of sounding obvious, Tigers can suffer from high temperatures. Anything you can do to increase cooling is worthwhile. Items such as extra thick and efficient radiator and an engine oil cooler (out of the path of air to the radiator) would help, along with a bathtub around the carb to ensure only cool fresh air goes in instead of hot air coming off the radiator. Also, I'd make sure to fill all body seams, like the Mk 1 Tigers. Flaring the fenders looks nice, as long (in my opinion) it is not overdone. I like the looks of a contoured hood scoop, instead of a bolt-on. A torque arm like the one Dan Walters sells (no, I'm not getting any commission) would help keep the rear wheels on the ground during acceleration. You mentioned the front suspension. Dale sells a complete front crossmember with all of the bells and whistles one might hope for. I'd add a good quality roll bar for safety. If you are making your car for go and not for show, think about leaving off the Tiger strips down the side and minimize the trim. Be sure to strengthen all of the normal weak spots that Tigers are known to have - this is obviously the time to do it.
Good luck with your project - it is nice to have a blank canvas on which to work!

Thanks for the great ideas. I'm not sure where the weak spots are, but I haven't read all the previous posts yet so I will keep a look out.
As far as filling body seams being filled, are you talking about, for example, the vertical ones below the tail lights? What were they filled with?
I had already thought about a larger Aluminum radiator with electric fans. I had also considered louvers in the hood to help with heat issues. Perhaps I'll look into a hood too. I am planning on making a torque arm also vs a traction- master set up. One I get the rear axle set up, I was thinking about a double panhard bar setup off the rear end cover plate. Probably a sway bar too.

Again thanks for the ideas!
-Kevin

Suggestions

One of the known weak spots in Tigers are their front crossmembers. If you buy a whole unit from Dale's, this is no longer an issue. If you are using a Tiger crossmember or a modified Alpine crossmember, you should beef it up. There is a company here in SoCal, Marsh Engineering, that got a lot of business back in the 80s and 90s welding up and strengthening Tiger front crossmembers. Since the crossmembers are week, they have a tendency to distort under stress. Marsh had (and probably still has) a jig to get everything back into alignment before they start welding on the stiffeners and adding in weldments.

Here is a link that has a good discussion and shows the work needed to eliminate some of the weak spots under the car - http://www.tigerengineering.net/TECHTIPS/Spring%20Mount%20Reinforcement.pdf. I believe they still sell the pieces prefabricated, with the precise measurements to go on properly.

Another area that people beef up are the holes in the frame through which the exhaust pipes go through, by the frame cross. I don't know enough about Alpines to predict what issues you might have (if you cut through your frame for you exhaust), but adding steel above and below the holes makes for a stronger car.

With regard to the seams, this depends on which model Alpine you have. Before Chrysler took over Rootes, almost all of the cars' seams were filled. Afterwards, to save $$$, they did not fill the seams between the front fenders and the panel on which the windshield is mounted. Another seam that went unfilled is the one on each rocker panel, right below the leading edge of each door. In the "good old days", lead was used to fill seams. I'm no body man, so I could not tell you what is best to use today.

By all indications I would expect Dale's entire front suspension and "cross member" to be the ultimate solution to the Tiger's bad Ackerman geometry. It may also be much easier on the steering effort. Unfortunately, while you get a lot, it also is not cheap. But that is a relative term.

If you decide on sticking with some version of the original front end, you might look into the new electrical power assisted steering that some of the lads in the UK have developed. As I understand it, the unit fits around an Alpine steering column and fits entirely under the dash. Supposedly the assist varies with vehicle speed, getting less involved at higher speeds. Its total amount of assist can be adjusted using a knob accessible from the driver's seat.

Handling of the stock suspension design can be vastly improved with a 1 inch anti-sway bar, but requires attachment clamps on the lower A arm be reinforced or they will rip out.

If you decide to improve the exhausting of hot air from the engine bay with fender side vents like the factory tried, be sure to incorporate a leading edge lip on the vent. That create negative pressure over the opening to help draw the air out at speed.

The rear track of the stock tiger is 3.5 inches narrower than the front. You might want to consider a different axle, or ways to make it closer to the front track. Getting wider wheels on the rear is seldom a bad idea.

The Alpine and Tiger wheel studs are only 7/16 diameter. With a lot of power going to the wheels you might want to consider upgrading to 1/2 inch studs especially if you are staying with only four studs per wheel. Will make things easier too when looking for aftermarket wheels. BTW, I remember reading somewhere that the factory did a prototype or at least some work related to a 5 stud wheel. If so doing that would be consistent with the "what a Tiger could have evolved to" theme.

On the motor, you might look into some of the aftermarket kits that replace the carb with fuel injection.

Gene

PS: Put the electric fuel pump in the trunk spare wheel well and get one that will properly feed the bigger motor through 3/8 fuel lines. The factory Tiger SU pump and 5/16 lines are barely adequate for a low reving 260.

Electric power steering?

EPS or EPAS is available in kit form for mustangs but I think a savvy DIYer could pull this off for a Sunbeam. http://forums.vintage-mustang.com/mod-custom-forum/670865-anyone-want-100-electric-power-steering-here-you-go.html
Bonus points for a speed sensor to phase in assist inversely with vehicle speed.

The 5-Bolt pattern is already in the plans. I am going to use a limited slip explorer 8.8" rear axle. For now I'm guessing 3.55 ratio with a TKO 600 and 15" wheels once I can figure out what wheels will fit. Flares would certainly give me some latitude, but budget constraints take them off the menu for now.

Thanks for the links re: body reinforcement. I will plan on that. A torque arm is in the cards as well.

Cheers! -Kevin

Power Steering

Dale brought a power steering unit he is starting to sell to a recent CAT meeting. I have heard there are others out there who are offering or are about to offer ones for Tigers. However, I have no experience with any of them.

When I sold my last Tiger they fit it with a P/S unit out of a Mazda I was told. Check the dimensions on the TKO600----even putting one in a Mustang requires modification to the tunnel and they have a lot of room.

cobrakidz said:

When I sold my last Tiger they fit it with a P/S unit out of a Mazda I was told. Check the dimensions on the TKO600----even putting one in a Mustang requires modification to the tunnel and they have a lot of room.

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I looked at Modern Driveline's website which directed me to Rootes Group Depot which sells the TKO 600 in kit form with a few modifications to fit in the Tiger. Since I am fabricating my own tunnel anyway I should't have an issue. The T56 would be cool too but it looks huge and heavy, and I simply don't see the need to use 6 speeds!

Cheers, -Kevin

Which fuel pump?

PS: Put the electric fuel pump in the trunk spare wheel well and get one that will properly feed the bigger motor through 3/8 fuel lines. The factory Tiger SU pump and 5/16 lines are barely adequate for a low reving 260.

This is great advice. I'll plan on that. Is the SU pump the best choice or is there a more modern pump that I should consider?

Cheers, -Kevin

My electronic SU will pump over a quart a minute to the carb thru a 5/16" line.

How much gas do you need?

Feed Me !!

Forrest39 said:

PS: Put the electric fuel pump in the trunk spare wheel well and get one that will properly feed the bigger motor through 3/8 fuel lines. The factory Tiger SU pump and 5/16 lines are barely adequate for a low reving 260.

This is great advice. I'll plan on that. Is the SU pump the best choice or is there a more modern pump that I should consider?

Cheers, -Kevin

Click to expand...

The AUF SU pump bails approx. 18 gallons in an hour. So, unless you're running flat out balls-to-the-wall across the Gobi, it's plenty big enough. An old racer's trick to avoid momentary open bore draw down is to plumb the last few feet with larger line (3/8" or better) and a large in-line filter which gives a ready pre-pressured volume increase for those downtown main street drags.

The next stupid question...

... In what may a series of stupid questions 😁.

I have been looking at many pictures of Tiger engine compartments with engines removed to try to understand what I need to do with the fender support brackets (if that's what they're called...). Form follows function as far as I'm concerned so as long as it doesn't look like a kludge-job I will be happy. I have noticed that the lower end of the brackets on an Alpine protrude inward at the frame rail where as the Tiger pictures show the frame rails to be more or less flush by where the engine hangers bolt in. Is this a correct observation and do I have to somehow remove this dimension from the replacement brackets in my design?

I'm hoping that somebody who has done some reinforcing of the fender supports on a Tiger might be able to give any advice or tips.

Cheers! -Kevin

fender supports (top hats)

Forrest39 said:

... In what may a series of stupid questions 😁.

I have been looking at many pictures of Tiger engine compartments with engines removed to try to understand what I need to do with the fender support brackets (if that's what they're called...). Form follows function as far as I'm concerned so as long as it doesn't look like a kludge-job I will be happy. I have noticed that the lower end of the brackets on an Alpine protrude inward at the frame rail where as the Tiger pictures show the frame rails to be more or less flush by where the engine hangers bolt in. Is this a correct observation and do I have to somehow remove this dimension from the replacement brackets in my design?
I just cut the bottom half off on mine. (cut of wheel) About 5 minutes per side. Car has been driven VERY hard. No side effests yet.

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Thanks George. That answers my question for the 'top hats'. Did you have to modify the frame rails between the engine hanger bolt holes and the rear crossmember bolt holes? Looks kinda like they have been made flush on a tiger from the pictures that I have seen.
Cheers, -Kevin

Modifications

Forrest39 said:

Thanks George. That answers my question for the 'top hats'. Did you have to modify the frame rails between the engine hanger bolt holes and the rear crossmember bolt holes? Looks kinda like they have been made flush on a tiger from the pictures that I have seen.
Cheers, -Kevin

Click to expand...

Kevin... No modifications required.

Cleared the first hurdle... CA DMV!

And it only took three visits! The Alpine I purchased has not been registered since 1983. It had been registered non-op, but had dropped out of the system. The title was also missing and the last known owner could not be determined. The car had changed hands three or four times and the paperwork I did have was a mess.
With it all sorted out, i hope to have a title in the mail in a few weeks.

Good news is that I have one piece of DMV paperwork that shows that the black plates that I have were assigned to the car at some point in it's lost history. When I get the car on the road I will be able to have those plates re-assigned to the vehicle.

I hopefully have my TR4 sold on Sunday at which point I can get going on this project!

Cheers, -Kevin

Good luck on the TR sale......I had a similar mess with a Mustang a few years ago--I went to a friend at the DMV and she filled out the lost title paperwork ( as if I owned the car and we lost the pink years ago) and we sent it on through--luckily it all worked out. Good to hear yours is coming to a happy ending.

Sold the TR4 today so hopefully I can start in on the Alpine now...

Decided to have a little fun with very basic cut and paste.

I think I like the look of the classic coke-bottle American Racing wheels

I forget now but are you converting to 5 bolt hubs or sticking with the 4 bolt wheel? If you stay 4 bolt the American 200S wheels (or Daisy mags ) have 4 spokes.

https://sp1.yimg.com/ib/th?id=HN.608029689826248433&pid=15.1

Forrest39 said:

Sold the TR4 today so hopefully I can start in on the Alpine now...

Decided to have a little fun with very basic cut and paste.

I think I like the look of the classic coke-bottle American Racing wheels

Click to expand...

Looks great.. but think the american libre wheels were only available in 4 spoke for alpine/tiger. VTO do a repro of these in 14 and 15 "as well.. but again.. 4 spoke. if you went to 5 lug you can probably get 5 spoke.