1964 ALGER Up For Auction at BaT.

Austin Healer

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a real pity... instead of transferring all the bits to an Alpine, they should have used the alpine to fix the Tiger!
 

HolyCat

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I'm not sure that there were many parts taken off a Tiger and installed on the Alpine. Without seeing what shape the Tiger was in, it is hard to say if saving the Tiger was possible. But I agree that it would be better, if possible, to save the Tiger using Alpine parts. By the way, are those cat converters shown in photos 46 & 50?
 

65beam

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a real pity... instead of transferring all the bits to an Alpine, they should have used the alpine to fix the Tiger!
Transferring the Tiger pieces to an Alpine has been done numerous times. Sometimes it the only way to restore a Tiger. Isn't the Tiger a converted Alpine body?
 

Austin Healer

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Transferring the Tiger pieces to an Alpine has been done numerous times. Sometimes it the only way to restore a Tiger. Isn't the Tiger a converted Alpine body?
NO, we've been through this before.... Tiger bodies started as Tiger bodies before they ever reached Jensen. Pressed steel omitted myriad parts that were part of an Alpine shell such as... The top hats, the trans tunnel and bulkhead , the battery box and the spare tire support were never installed into a shell destined to be a Tiger. It would have been stupid to fabricate and install parts into a shell, just to cut them out to change the specification. Why on earth would you weld in parts, just to hack them out at a later date??? Aside from being a monumental waste, it also would have left obvious scars in the structure that would be visible to this day... the bottom line... There are none of these scars, so it is obvious to anyone familiar with the construction of a Tiger body shell that they started out as Tigers, not Alpines... This is part of why it is so hard to build a convincing clone.... Anyone who is , in the slightest, aware of how a Tiger was built will be able to tell an Alpine from a Tiger shell from 15 feet. Hopefully, this is why we have a TAC system. This is part of the ROTA system that alerted Pressed Steel which cars would be Alpines and which cars would end up as Tigers. There were two separate lines... this is why there were only 15 GT Tigers... It was just too disruptive to the Pressed Steel line to have 4 different possible permutations of the body shell. In the end it was decided that Tigers would only be offered as a convertible with a fixed (bolted on conv. top) and the Alpine could be ordered either way.
 
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65beam

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NO, we've been through this before.... Tiger bodies started as Tiger bodies before they ever reached Jensen. Pressed steel omitted myriad parts that were part of an Alpine shell such as... The top hats, the trans tunnel and bulkhead , the battery box and the spare tire support were never installed into a shell destined to be a Tiger. It would have been stupid to fabricate and install parts into a shell, just to cut them out to change the specification. Why on earth would you weld in parts, just to hack them out at a later date??? Aside from being a monumental waste, it also would have left obvious scars in the structure that would be visible to this day... the bottom line... There are none of these scars, so it is obvious to anyone familiar with the construction of a Tiger body shell that they started out as Tigers, not Alpines... This is part of why it is so hard to build a convincing clone.... Anyone who is , in the slightest, aware of how a Tiger was built will be able to tell an Alpine from a Tiger shell from 15 feet. Hopefully, this is why we have a TAC system. This is part of the ROTA system that alerted Pressed Steel which cars would be Alpines and which cars would end up as Tigers. There were two separate lines... this is why there were only 15 GT Tigers... It was just too disruptive to the Pressed Steel line to have 4 different possible permutations of the body shell. In the end it was decided that Tigers would only be offered as a convertible with a fixed (bolted on conv. top) and the Alpine could be ordered either way.
I haven't driven a Tiger for close to 14 years. I've been busy building other more rare Sunbeams .
 

Warren

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Back on topic...
None of us seem to mind or wonder if it's a real GTO or a Pontiac Tempest. That's because of the ID that those cars have.

Another resale red one that was done crudely in a garage or under a shade tree. Ha ha it's got a CAT back system too. If it was in California the "economically disenfranchised," would pass as it's too low to the ground to steal those converter's:)
 

Austin Healer

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Back on topic...
None of us seem to mind or wonder if it's a real GTO or a Pontiac Tempest. That's because of the ID that those cars have.

Another resale red one that was done crudely in a garage or under a shade tree. Ha ha it's got a CAT back system too. If it was in California the "economically disenfranchised," would pass as it's too low to the ground to steal those converter's:)
You can tell an early GTO (1964/65) from a Tempest by the core support.... the radiators are different.... larger in the GTO (and, yes... I cared!) Restored a 389 tri power 4 speed in another life!
 

65beam

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You can tell an early GTO (1964/65) from a Tempest by the core support.... the radiators are different.... larger in the GTO (and, yes... I cared!) Restored a 389 tri power 4 speed in another life!
I've seen so many folks build cars that have to be 100 % correct simply because they plan to flip it at some point and that can add some value to the sale. I'm also an owner that drove the cars when they were new and there were problems much like the recalls of today. Having done several restorations we've made subtle changes based on the problems encountered over the years. One of those changes that Doug at Tiger Auto did was to install a front brace for setting the car on jack stands.

107_0196.JPG
 
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Austin Healer

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I just do things as close to original because that's what I am wired for... I don't buy and sell cars, it's usually a fool's errand as you end up working for free...
 

Warren

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Back to the topic that car sold for 25,000 plus BaT buyer's premium plus sales tax depending on what state it went to. Strong $ even adjusted for recent inflation.
 

65beam

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I just do things as close to original because that's what I am wired for...
I know other Sunbeam owners that think the same as you. I'm not one of that group because I started driving in the mid 60's and modification of cars was wide spread.
 

HolyCat

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I also started driving in the mid-60s. But in those days, a 67 Tiger was not close to being a classic (yet). Modifications were done because these cars were our every day drivers. If I knew then what I know now, I would not have swapped out some parts from my car, or at least would have saved those parts. It took me quite awhile to locate those parts in the used parts market over the last 30 years. But that is the beauty of our cars - they can be whatever you want - stock, personalized, or performance modified. Fortunately, Tiger clubs accept us all.
 

65beam

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I also started driving in the mid-60s. But in those days, a 67 Tiger was not close to being a classic (yet). Modifications were done because these cars were our every day drivers. If I knew then what I know now, I would not have swapped out some parts from my car, or at least would have saved those parts. It took me quite awhile to locate those parts in the used parts market over the last 30 years. But that is the beauty of our cars - they can be whatever you want - stock, personalized, or performance modified. Fortunately, Tiger clubs accept us all.
My dad had originally bought the series 4 and I always wondered if he knew I drove an Alpine before getting my driver license. After it became my every day car anything I removed such as the bumpers and grill stayed in Dad's garage. Doug reinstalled the grill when he restored the car. I still have the Hella lights that I installed in the grill opening in the early 70's. If I part out a car I never throw any part away except for the body. Those that have been to my garages can verify that.
 

canbeam

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Depending on the condition of the Tiger, purely from an economic point of view it is probably cheaper for the amateur restorer hobbyist with limited skills to buy a solid rust free Alpine shell, use bits from the rusted Tiger like the tunnel which are usually ok for rust, and make the other functional mods. Yah, the Alger will be worth half of the real Tiger at the end, but the owner will have the same driving experience without a ton of cash flow. I had a real nice rebodied Tiger/Alger years ago and I couldn't tell any difference from my stock Tiger driving it. A friend of mine just bought an Alger last Fall from a guy that used parts from his badly rusted Tiger and it looks pretty nice as you can see in the pic, and he loves it, and as a bonus, it only cost him about $15000 USD. You couldn't buy a Tiger wreck and an Alpine shell and create that car for that money, so that is truly the most inexpensive way to enjoy the Tiger experience. Let someone else do the work, turn the key and go...lol

Alger JG (2)_LI.jpg
 
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