Electri cooling fans

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I had a Spal on one of my last street rods and was very happy. I have read that the curved blades are quieter than the straight blades, either way it pulled a lot of air..
 
Electric fans

TIGER TOM AND ASSOCIATES DID A WHOLE TREATASE ON COOLING, INCLUDING FANS WHICH IS POSTED ON THE TIGERS EAST WEB SITE. I INSTALLED A JEGS (ON SALE) 12 IN STRAIGHT BLADE PUSHER ELECTRIC FAN WITH THERMOSTAT ON THE FRONT OF THE RADIATOR AS A HELPER AT IDLE OR IN TRAFFIC TO COMPLIMENT A HAYDEN 14 INCH PULLER ALUMINUM FAN.
 
I've got a fan and a Peterbuilt radiator that Paul Reisentz supplied for my car and temp runs around 180-185 on a hot day unless I'm in stop-and-go traffic. Then, I'm around 200, or a bit higher.

Except:

There was one time on a VERY hot day, when traffic was completely stopped for at least a half-hour and I feared over heating. Fortunately, I was able to do a u-turn and find a bit more open road which led to a freeway. I would have loved having electric fans that time!
 
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not a cure all

I can run all day and not go over 200 while moving...mostly 175-185 on the highway. Stopped, I go over 200 and keep on going until I get moving again. This is with about 325 hp and a stock hood- no scoops or vents. I tried an electric fan for idle situations, and it lowered the temps 5-10 degrees and bought me a few extra minutes, but, eventually temps headed back up over 200. Whatever cooling inadequacies you have without an electric fan are only delayed for a while with the electric fan. YMMV.
 
A BIG thank you to Duke for this one.
Before adding a cooling fan, make sure that your ignition's vacuum advance is connected to manifold vacuum, not carburetor throttle port vacuum. You need to adjust your timing (static advance + vacuum advance) in such a way that you are getting 24 to 27 degrees of advance at idle. After I did this, like magic my idle overheating problem went away. I was so impressed with this revelation that I did this to two of my buddies Tigers and their idle overheating problem also went away (they think that I am a hero, but I did credit Duke). You will have to adjust the carburetor idle mixture and speed after you do this.
 
I too did most of the mods that TigerTom suggested in his study.

http://www.teae.org/tech_tips/hot_air.html

Different cars have different air-cleaner to hood clearance. Mine was tight to start with, so in order to get that 15" Derale fan to clear the rack, instead of raising the motor, I lowered the rack by simply adding a 1/4" steel plate in between the frame & the front crossmember. I am sure that many people are horrified at this approach, but it works just fine for a highway cruiser (non racing) Tiger.
I also mounted an 11" Spal pusher fan, spaced about 3/4" from the core as Tom suggested. I have the small pulley & one of Rick's S.S. water pumps. One of my nieghbors who drag races suggested a premium Thermostat like this one..

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/BRA-330-160/

My horns are blocked, my timing is correct, & block was recently boiled out, & my temperature guage is reading correctly. My engine was Dynoed at 275 "real" hp.

I just drove 2000 miles each way to SUNI, taking no Interstates. Even getting stuck idling for a 1/2 hour in road construction in scorching 99 degree weather in Arkansas, the temperature never got over 180 degrees. For the first time in 40+ years of driving this car, the temperature guage is something that I do not have to worry about anymore. I am a happy guy....
 
Duke Mk1a said:
You are welcome.
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Duke.....

What is the timing advance when first cranking the motor ??
The problem is that using high levels of initial advance can lead to serious damage unless provision is made to retard the timing during cranking. Pistons and rings don't like high initial advance especially cold....


I run an aluminum radiator and a modified Edelbrock high volume water pump
on my 302 making 385hp and it runs 190 F all day long with 12 degrees initial advance.

Moondoggie
 
Duke Mk1a said:
There is not any vacuum advance when cranking. I run 12 degrees static. So 12 is the answer.
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Actually there is vacuum otherwise your carb wouldn't work. I know allot
of guys do this on race engines with big cams but race engines don't go
50,000 miles. I would be more concerned about detonation for the first couple of minutes while the motor warned up.

Moondoggie
 
Moondoggie said:
Actually there is vacuum otherwise your carb wouldn't work. I know allot of guys do this on race engines with big cams but race engines don't go
50,000 miles. I would be more concerned about detonation for the first couple of minutes while the motor warned up.

Moondoggie
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Dawg, are you messin with me or what??

Low vacuum during cranking (~3"), accelerator pump shoots fuel into manifold and is sucked into engine. If I remember correctly, my vacuum advance pot will not even start to pull any till over 5". Cranking rpm is very low so vacuum is very low..will measure cranking vacuum if any once I am home. No detonation under idle conditions as the engine is not under load. Who drives any engine hard till it's warmed up anyway? Any application of the loud pedal and vacuum is gone.
 
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Duke Mk1a said:
Dawg, are you mess in with me or what??

No vacuum during cranking, accelerator pump shoots fuel into manifold and is sucked into engine. Cranking rpm is very low so if there were any vacuum it would be very low..will measure cranking vacuum if any once I am home. No detonation under idle conditions as the engine is not under load. Who drives any engine hard till it's warmed up anyway? Any application of the loud pedal and vacuum is gone.
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Duke,

I would never mess with anyone that has the patients and fortitude to speed a year away from his family and Tiger just 18 miles from the Korean DMZ...You deserve big thank you from me.....

Maybe I'm old school but too much advance even under no load conditions just doesn't seem right. Take for example the K Code 289's they all ran mechanical advance distributors with just 12 degree initial timing and no vacuum advance. Advance came on at 1800 and maxed out at 2500 @ 33 degrees total. Wouldn't Ford have just set the timing at 34 degrees
and forgot about all the advance hardware if it was safe.....

Moondoggie
 
Moondoggie said:
Duke,

I would never mess with anyone that has the patients and fortitude to speed a year away from his family and Tiger just 18 miles from the Korean DMZ...You deserve big thank you from me.....
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You are welcome, its a job someone has to do.... With that, cant wait to get the hell out of here. Waiting to turn in my gas mask the day before I fly just to be sure. ;)
 
Duke Mk1a said:
You are welcome, its a job someone has to do.... With that, cant wait to get the hell out of here. Waiting to turn in my gas mask the day before I fly just to be sure. ;)
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I can relate to that !!! I spent a year (1968) at a remote Air Force radar site,
King Salmon Alaska. When it was time to return state side I was flown to Elmendorf AFB and turned in my artic wear. Then was told it would be a five day wait for the next Air Force seat to Seattle and was given a room at the transit barracks. A year is a long long time as you now know, so I took a taxi cab to Anchorage International Airport and bought my own ticket home to San Francisco. Spent the next two weeks on leave and then reported for duty at Fortuna AFS in North Dakota...The Air Force never asked how I got home from Alaska. The service is probably different now.

Moondoggie
 
Well Beyond Sunbeam but...

Moondoggie said:
I can relate to that !!! I spent a year (1968) at a remote Air Force radar site,
King Salmon Alaska. When it was time to return state side I was flown to Elmendorf AFB and turned in my artic wear. Then was told it would be a five day wait for the next Air Force seat to Seattle and was given a room at the transit barracks. A year is a long long time as you now know, so I took a taxi cab to Anchorage International Airport and bought my own ticket home to San Francisco. Spent the next two weeks on leave and then reported for duty at Fortuna AFS in North Dakota...The Air Force never asked how I got home from Alaska. The service is probably different now.

Moondoggie
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#382000428 was at Elmendorf for awhile while Capt D was extracting and other stuff in S.E.A. (I was at E.AFB too...very briefly). A number of Ti's parts, front grill, air cleaner and steering wheel and original steel wheels went missing right around that time frame... hmmmm.... They couldn't find the USAF shipping ledger, the boxes just seem to have gone AWOL, as if they got on a separate flight... ;)

mysteries... make life more interesting...
 
DD (CA) said:
#382000428 was at Elmendorf for awhile while Capt D was extracting and other stuff in S.E.A. (I was at E.AFB too...very briefly). A number of Ti's parts, front grill, air cleaner and steering wheel and original steel wheels went missing right around that time frame... hmmmm.... They couldn't find the USAF shipping ledger, the boxes just seem to have gone AWOL, as if they got on a separate flight... ;)

mysteries... make life more interesting...
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I spent about a week at Elmendorf when I was processing to go out to the radar site. They basically took care of any medical stuff so that you could survive for a year way out there. We also did a bunch of survival training and
firearm training. While Duke spent his time golfing I spent my time fly fishing
on some of Alaska's best rivers a few feet from the radar towers. On more than one occasion I came face to face with an Alaskan brown bear on the river so never left the site without my 44 magnum Rugger side arm. On the return I hitched a ride with the Commander of the Alaska Air Command back to Elmendorf and he told me not to wait around for operations to find me a ride back home...just go !! Having the last name of Doolittle seemed to work pretty well while I was in the Air Force...

Moondoggie
 
Moondoggie said:
I would be more concerned about detonation for the first couple of minutes while the motor warned up.

Moondoggie
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I have settled on 15 degrees of initial static advance, 23 degrees of centrifugal advance (all-in at 2600 RPMs), and 12 degrees of vacuum advance at 15" or higher vacuum. I have found that this combination works well on Ford small blocks with up to a 9.5:1 compression ratio and a mild cam. With higher compression ratios you will need to back the initial static advance down a little.
My vacuum advance doesn't even begin to pull in until there is at least 8" of vacuum, an engine won't develop anywhere near this much vacuum during startup cranking.
One does not need to be concerned that much with detonation during warm-up because the engine is running so much richer when the choke is partially closed than it does at normal operating temperature when the choke is wide open.
 
wag123 said:
I have settled on 15 degrees of initial static advance, 23 degrees of centrifugal advance (all-in at 2600 RPMs), and 12 degrees of vacuum advance at 15" or higher vacuum. I have found that this combination works well on Ford small blocks with up to a 9.5:1 compression ratio and a mild cam. With higher compression ratios you will need to back the initial static advance down a little.
My vacuum advance doesn't even begin to pull in until there is at least 8" of vacuum, an engine won't develop anywhere near this much vacuum during startup cranking.
One does not need to be concerned that much with detonation during warm-up because the engine is running so much richer when the choke is partially closed than it does at normal operating temperature when the choke is wide open.
Click to expand...

You should not run more than 33 degrees total advance in a Ford small block
and running as much as 45 degrees on the highway with vacuum advance for gas mileage if you are concerned with mileage seems to work on stock motors. My 302 is not even in the neighborhood of being stock @ 385 hp and what's a choke !!!....Detonation of any kind will damage your motor it just takes longer in a stock motor...

Moondoggie
 
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